A serious question

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A serious question

Postby Voly » Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:08 am

Although this topic will probably derail before the end of the first page, this is a question that I have wondered for a long time.

Obviously, technology has been advancing at a much greater rate than ever before, and our knowledge of sciences and such is at the highest point it has ever been. But these advancements aside, has the common person been getting smarter, decreasing in intelligence, or staying relatively the same? On a common-sense, problem-solving level, or on a social level, or whatever level you want to use to respond.

I'm just curious about everyone's opinions on this subject.

And as always, feel free to flame the shit out of people you disagree with.
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Postby HeRetiK » Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:56 am

I think overall people are getting smarter. There's a lot of (interactive) input coming in, so there's a lot of information to progress. And people start learning to progress this information at an very early age by now.

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Postby Zyn » Mon Sep 17, 2012 1:40 pm

Well, I suppose what really matters here is how you define intelligence. But, since I'm too lazy to make a massive argument-post about my definition of intelligence, I'm just going to say:

Statistically, people are exhibiting a greater aptitude with and a more pronounced number of mental skills that most people would consider benchmark; reading, writing, ect.

Additionally, college-level (and higher) education has become more accessible (whether or not it's worth anything is a second argument, but~) allowing more people to, throughout their life, know more and learn more.

Again, is this intelligence? Not necessarily; these things may be indicators or enablers, however.
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Postby Astica » Mon Sep 17, 2012 4:47 pm

There's definitely more access to education than there used to be, but some technology is making people lazy, as well. Like Zyn says, depends what you mean by intelligence.

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Postby ƒrosty » Tue Sep 18, 2012 1:28 am

Seems to me the smart are getting smarter, and the stupid are just getting louder.
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Postby Zyn » Tue Sep 18, 2012 4:13 am

Sounds accurate.
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Postby Voly » Tue Sep 18, 2012 8:20 am

I suppose I should have mentioned that I don't necessarily mean "educated".
Astica wrote:That's probably the wankiest thing I've heard all day.

Elen wrote:If they were just bickering about politics, instead of indulging ERQ's passive-aggressive, self-aggrandizing fuckassery, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

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Re: A serious question

Postby Davion Fuxa » Tue Sep 18, 2012 3:32 pm

Voly wrote:...has the common person been getting smarter, decreasing in intelligence, or staying relatively the same? On a common-sense, problem-solving level, or on a social level, or whatever level you want to use to respond.


With the advent of technology of today, people have access to new ways to gain access to information, but at the same time old relics like television, radio, and newspapers are still around. Overall, this leads to people being smarter because there is so many different inputs you can grab information from.

That said, just because people are smarter doesn't mean a whole lot. People are also very apathetic as well as they are informed. Well, most of the older generations are, the younger generations of today are somewhat annoyed; this extends past the people in Libya, Tunisia, Egypt, Syria, and so forth to people in Western Countries as well.

Overall, I wouldn't say people are much smarter from their older counterpart generations. A lot of things have changed but more or less things have remained the same.
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Postby Guitar_clock » Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:14 am

In addition to the previous post; wisdom has all but ceased to exist.

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Postby Stalkerlicious » Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:22 pm

Who needs wisdom when you have a facebook feed!?
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Postby Zyn » Thu Sep 20, 2012 2:35 am

Guitar_clock wrote:In addition to the previous post; wisdom has all but ceased to exist.


I'm expecting more proof before I accept that.
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Postby obskewer » Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:55 am

With the vast wealth of both meaningful and useless information in the world, a person can grow to be very smart and still be purely dimwitted. Not all information is good information, and with the growing trend of electronic media the internet has become a safe haven for most things otherwise painfully unintelligible. Even though we can spit off random anthropological and geological facts doesn't mean we know anything about those cultures or their inhabitants. We don't even need to understand or associate with those we feel are wrong. Technology may makE the individual smarter and more high speed, but keeps the group in a socially progressive declination of intelligence.

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Postby HeRetiK » Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:04 am

Obskewer wrote:With the vast wealth of both meaningful and useless information in the world, a person can grow to be very smart and still be purely dimwitted.


Very true. You can be clever, but still be an idiot.

Obskewer wrote:Not all information is good information, and with the growing trend of electronic media the internet has become a safe haven for most things otherwise painfully unintelligible. Even though we can spit off random anthropological and geological facts doesn't mean we know anything about those cultures or their inhabitants. We don't even need to understand or associate with those we feel are wrong.


Theory and practice are two different things and reading something on the internet won't give you the ability to do fully understand it in practice. However I still think your wrong with this one. Humans are not simply input-output machines. We're able to adapt, also to change in information flows. So what will happen is that people will progressively get better at filtering information and critically examining it. Some 20 years ago people would simply believe everything they saw on TV. Now it's common sense to either check and backtrack the data or to take it with a huge grain of salt. (if common sense would only be more common...)

Obskewer wrote:Technology may makE the individual smarter and more high speed, but keeps the group in a socially progressive declination of intelligence.


On what grounds do you assume that the group will get dumber while the individual gets smarter?
I think it's quite the contrary. In some rare cases the individual may stand out, but in most cases the collective wisdom is still more than the sum of its parts. The individual gets smarter, so the group gets smarter. (of course the stupid always are the loudest, so it might seem that the group stays dumb)

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Postby Guitar_clock » Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:50 pm

Zyn wrote:
Guitar_clock wrote:In addition to the previous post; wisdom has all but ceased to exist.


I'm expecting more proof before I accept that.

You want me to prove that wisdom has all but ceased to exist. You want me to quantify something that cannot be tested for nor polled.

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Postby Zyn » Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:19 pm

Guitar_clock wrote:
Zyn wrote:
Guitar_clock wrote:In addition to the previous post; wisdom has all but ceased to exist.


I'm expecting more proof before I accept that.

You want me to prove that wisdom has all but ceased to exist. You want me to quantify something that cannot be tested for nor polled.


I want you to at least have some sort of argument behind such an unbelievable claim. Otherwise, there doesn't seem much point in saying except to be unbelievable.
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Postby Davion Fuxa » Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:48 pm

Zyn wrote:
Guitar_clock wrote:
Zyn wrote:
Guitar_clock wrote:In addition to the previous post; wisdom has all but ceased to exist.


I'm expecting more proof before I accept that.

You want me to prove that wisdom has all but ceased to exist. You want me to quantify something that cannot be tested for nor polled.


I want you to at least have some sort of argument behind such an unbelievable claim. Otherwise, there doesn't seem much point in saying except to be unbelievable.


Thinking about Wisdom, I think an argument can be made that the opposite is true in regards to technology.

Technology of today provides the ability for people to be more knowledgeable as people can learn about topics but also further research them on their own. Through doing so people can begin to gain an understanding of such topics and underlying themes and key points. From there they can infer on their own or seek opinions of others in forming their own opinion.

This is in contrast to them not being able to do so, be it because it was not convenient, that they didn't have access to research on their own, or doing so may put them at risk.
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Postby Voly » Fri Sep 21, 2012 3:19 am

We currently have knowledge, because we are constantly surrounded by information. As a culture, the DESIRE for knowledge has all but died. It is a rare type of person (many of whom I believe inhabit this forum) who will go out of their way by their own volition without any foreseeable gains, just to learn something new. I know very few people who research for the sake of research.

Now, I am aware that in the past, this was also similarly true. Most people avoided unnecessarily learning. But the fact of the matter is, while information is more readily available today, less people (I feel) are actively seeking it out. We know more as a product of our society cramming everyone with information.

That's not necessarily a bad thing, but that's my standpoint.
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Postby Voly » Fri Sep 21, 2012 3:19 am

We currently have knowledge, because we are constantly surrounded by information. As a culture, the DESIRE for knowledge has all but died. It is a rare type of person (many of whom I believe inhabit this forum) who will go out of their way by their own volition without any foreseeable gains, just to learn something new. I know very few people who research for the sake of research.

Now, I am aware that in the past, this was also similarly true. Most people avoided unnecessarily learning. But the fact of the matter is, while information is more readily available today, less people (I feel) are actively seeking it out. We know more as a product of our society cramming everyone with information.

That's not necessarily a bad thing, but that's my standpoint.
Astica wrote:That's probably the wankiest thing I've heard all day.

Elen wrote:If they were just bickering about politics, instead of indulging ERQ's passive-aggressive, self-aggrandizing fuckassery, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

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Postby evilredqueen » Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:52 am

Mankind on an individual basis is evolving continuously .... smarter, faster, stronger .... I think easily provable if needed.
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Postby Voly » Tue Sep 25, 2012 4:15 am

Show me a pie chart.
Astica wrote:That's probably the wankiest thing I've heard all day.

Elen wrote:If they were just bickering about politics, instead of indulging ERQ's passive-aggressive, self-aggrandizing fuckassery, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

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Postby Elen Sila » Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:36 am

A... pie chart?
But... that's not what you would use to show improvement over time....
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Postby evilredqueen » Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:00 pm

I find it so funny that Elen can't see my posts but continues to post things that share my feelings. lol Ironic


Voly more like a line of evolution?

" During the Civil War a soldiers average height was 5 ft. 8-1/4 inches and the average weight was 143-1/2 pounds. "

Look up the average for today.
Zyn wrote:Because God knows ERQ has always been a font of sensible and well-supported opinions.

Voly wrote:ASSASSINATE ALL THEM GOT-DAMN NIGGER SYMPATHIZERS


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Postby Zyn » Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:48 pm

evilredqueen wrote:I find it so funny that Elen can't see my posts but continues to post things that share my feelings. lol Ironic


Voly more like a line of evolution?

" During the Civil War a soldiers average height was 5 ft. 8-1/4 inches and the average weight was 143-1/2 pounds. "

Look up the average for today.


While I understand what you're trying to do here, you might want instead to go for something more in relation to intelligence, like (unscaled) IQ scores of the time, or even the total size of the skull which (it I'm up to date) is shown to influence if not directly determine the intelligence in relation to "human normal".

Or I could just be talking out of my ass, as that was one of those "Pretty sure I read somewhere" facts.
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Postby Voly » Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:38 am

I like pie charts.

Line graph if you must.

I want quantifiable proof that humans are getting stronger, smarter, and faster.

ERQ asserts that it is easily provable. I'm not seeing it.
Astica wrote:That's probably the wankiest thing I've heard all day.

Elen wrote:If they were just bickering about politics, instead of indulging ERQ's passive-aggressive, self-aggrandizing fuckassery, then I wouldn't have a problem with it.

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Postby ƒrosty » Wed Sep 26, 2012 4:14 pm

A chart wouldn't be proof.
[/somebullshit]


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